Westie

The general election (June 2017)

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I do of course realise that how people vote is a very personal thing indeed. However, how on earth can Ms.May, now that she has launched the tory manifesto, expect senior citizens to give her their vote, having said that her party are in favour of, eg, the abolishing of the triple lock system on state pensions, abolishing the heating allowance (also being called the dementia tax) to name just two policies of hers, and there are others. Pensioners will be shooting themselves in the foot surely. It's like turkeys voting for xmas as they say.

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The alternative is like Turkey's voting for Christmas day to be brought forward to June. I would not trust Corbyn or McDonald with anything, least of all the economy.

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16 hours ago, Westie said:

I do of course realise that how people vote is a very personal thing indeed. However, how on earth can Ms.May, now that she has launched the tory manifesto, expect senior citizens to give her their vote, having said that her party are in favour of, eg, the abolishing of the triple lock system on state pensions, abolishing the heating allowance (also being called the dementia tax) to name just two policies of hers, and there are others. Pensioners will be shooting themselves in the foot surely. It's like turkeys voting for xmas as they say.

I live in Scotland and because of that I will not have to experience the issues you list but even if I had to I would still cast my vote for the Conservatives at the forthcoming General Election. We pensioners have been rather fortunate these past few years and I understand the State Pension has increased by something like 25%  in recent times. 

Due to an increasingly aging population, the generous triple lock on State Pensions is fast becoming unsustainable but even when it is withdrawn there will still exist a double lock to provide a fair measure of protection against inflation etc.

So far as Winter Fuel Allowance is concerned, do you really think that someone like me whose various pensions and investments net him in excess of £40,000 p.a. should require assistance from public funds to pay their fuel bills? How can this be justified?  I would like to see Winter Fuel Allowance confined to those who are found to be in genuine fuel poverty.  I know several pensioners who drink, smoke, run expensive cars, gamble and go on frequent cruises and foreign holidays and still receive Winter Fuel Allowance. Some of them are not even in the UK for much of the cold weather. And what about those UK pensioners who live permanently abroad in warm countries?  Why should any of them receive this Allowance?

Some of them say, ``But we paid into it all our working lives.'' Fair comment, but surely you should only receive a benefit if you are in a situation that benefit was introduced to alleviate.  We don't receive unemployment benefit unless we are unemployed and we don't receive child benefit unless we have children. So surely it follows that we should not receive disbursements from public funds unless we are truly unable to pay our fuel bills.  

 I think Mrs May is a realist and is not sticking her head in the sand when it  comes to looking at the financial problems an aging population will surely bring about.  We could do with more like her.      

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2 hours ago, Zulu 22 said:

The alternative is like Turkey's voting for Christmas day to be brought forward to June. I would not trust Corbyn or McDonald with anything, least of all the economy.

These individuals represent everything this country does not need and I do not trust either of them.

Quite apart from the economy I remind myself of how they both supported the IRA and continue to refuse to condemn terrorism. 

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23 hours ago, oldcopper said:

I live in Scotland and because of that I will not have to experience the issues you list but even if I had to I would still cast my vote for the Conservatives at the forthcoming General Election. We pensioners have been rather fortunate these past few years and I understand the State Pension has increased by something like 25%  in recent times. 

Due to an increasingly aging population, the generous triple lock on State Pensions is fast becoming unsustainable but even when it is withdrawn there will still exist a double lock to provide a fair measure of protection against inflation etc.

So far as Winter Fuel Allowance is concerned, do you really think that someone like me whose various pensions and investments net him in excess of £40,000 p.a. should require assistance from public funds to pay their fuel bills? How can this be justified?  I would like to see Winter Fuel Allowance confined to those who are found to be in genuine fuel poverty.  I know several pensioners who drink, smoke, run expensive cars, gamble and go on frequent cruises and foreign holidays and still receive Winter Fuel Allowance. Some of them are not even in the UK for much of the cold weather. And what about those UK pensioners who live permanently abroad in warm countries?  Why should any of them receive this Allowance?

Some of them say, ``But we paid into it all our working lives.'' Fair comment, but surely you should only receive a benefit if you are in a situation that benefit was introduced to alleviate.  We don't receive unemployment benefit unless we are unemployed and we don't receive child benefit unless we have children. So surely it follows that we should not receive disbursements from public funds unless we are truly unable to pay our fuel bills.  

 I think Mrs May is a realist and is not sticking her head in the sand when it  comes to looking at the financial problems an aging population will surely bring about.  We could do with more like her.      

 

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The expression that comes to mind here is 'I'm alright jack' but sadly, there are many who are not alright, through no fault of their own.

 

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1 hour ago, Westie said:

The expression that comes to mind here is 'I'm alright jack' but sadly, there are many who are not alright, through no fault of their own.

 

I would agree with OC on this. If you receive any pension, other then the OAP, then you should not need a winter fuel allowance. This living abroad in countries like Spain, Cyprus etc, should not be eligible for Winter Fuel Allowance. If they want to say that they have paid in therefore they are entitled, then not so. Why would a Millionaire need a fuel supplement?  When they were paying in there was no such thing as the winter fuel allowance. It was meant for those genuinely in need. My parents enjoy their Old Age Pension but they do not believe that they should get increases above the level of other sectors increases.

Perhaps Mrs May is being a lot fairer than people give her credit for. As for Social Care, at present a person pays for their care until they reach a level of £23,000 savings. The proposal would raise this level to £100,000. Like everything that the other parties are promising, they will not have to provide, if they did the unanswerable question would remain, Where are they going to get the money from to finance this.

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20 hours ago, Westie said:

The expression that comes to mind here is 'I'm alright jack' but sadly, there are many who are not alright, through no fault of their own.

 

You are completely wrong.  I am not in the least against those who genuinely suffer from fuel poverty and have difficulty paying heating  bills receiving Winter Fuel Allowance. What I do oppose is the payment of this allowance to those perfectly able to pay it without recourse to the benefit system and I would suggest that a significant number of recipients of this allowance are (like me) well able to pay their own way. 

So the many you refer to who are ``not alright through no fault of their own'' would continue to receive the allowance and the Benefits System would actually be able to pay them an increase in the amount of allowance they receive due to those who do not need it having the allowance withdrawn. What can possibly be wrong with that?

Unfortunately, our Benefits System has become a gravy train which a significant number of the population feel it is OK to dip into (if they get the opportunity) even when they have no genuine need of the assistance. It is a `fill your boots' mentality.  Politicians of all hues have contributed to this situation by giving bribes to the electorate which are politically difficult to withdraw when they become unsustainable or when it is recognised that they may be inappropriate in certain cases.

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If Ms.May and her party get elected at the general election: don't be old, don't be a pensioner, don't be cold in the  winter, don't be ill and don't be a fox.

That'll do for starters.

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2 hours ago, Westie said:

If Ms.May and her partdeaet elected at tkilling machineseection: don't be old, don' t be a pensioner, don't be cold in the  winter, don't be ill and don't be tfox.

That'll do for start ers.

You are sounding like a Corbynista, and they do nit deal in reality. They don't condemn IRA terrorists who reveled in murder. We have no other option, and the elderly would can afford it will not miss it, neither will they go cold otr starve. If you live in the country you will know that foxes are indescriminate killing machines.

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13 hours ago, Westie said:

If Ms.May and her party get elected at the general election: don't be old, don't be a pensioner, don't be cold in the  winter, don't be ill and don't be a fox.

That'll do for starters.

Apart from being a fox I am, or have been, all of these things at some time and still intend casting my vote for Mrs May. 

During the earlier ppart of my life I that I would be ill, cold or a pensioner at some time in the future (if I lived) and took whatever actions I could to prepare for those eventualities and a major part of that waqs getting my priorities in the correct order. As a resident of the UK I feel fortunate that I was born here and  not in a great many other countries I could mention. This country is not perfect but it is streets ahead of most others and I hope we can keep it that way.

But thus far you have not justified why all pensioners, regardless of their financial status, should receive Winter Fuel Allowance, an issue you mentioned in a previois post.   I would be interested to hear your logic on this.

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On 25 May 2017 at 19:55, Westie said:

If Ms.May and her party get elected at the general election: don't be old, don't be a pensioner, don't be cold in the  winter, don't be ill and don't be a fox.

That'll do for starters.

One of the problems with manifestos and policies is that people only think very superficially and never think about the bigger picture. Whilst you might not have heating allowance, other policies that they intend to introduce may well have the effect of making you better off.

It seems to be a common misconception with Police officers that the Tories hate the Police and as Labour have said they will recruit another 10,000 Police officers (at varying costs!!) so therefore we will be far better off under Labour. They conveniently seem to forget the fact that to pay for all these extra things Labour are promising, it's going to cost an astonishing extra £75 billion, which quite simply means far heavier taxation. 

As for what OC mentioned above, I thoroughly agree with. My father is extremely rich, however he gets winter fuel allowance. Why?

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It is very easy to promise the earth when you will never be in a position to introduce it. Everything has to be paid for and the hard left have no possibility to fund it. Corbyn, McDonald and Abbott seem to be devoid of even the basics of finance. 

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On 27/05/2017 at 13:04, Zulu 22 said:

It is very easy to promise the earth when you will never be in a position to introduce it. Everything has to be paid for and the hard left have no possibility to fund it. Corbyn, McDonald and Abbott seem to be devoid of even the basics of finance. 

They are also lying. What they are now saying is completely at variance with what they have said in the past and I am of the opinion that are only saying things like hiring extra police etc. in the hope of hoodwinking the electorate.

Sadly, some are gullible enough to fall for such perfidy.

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So another hung parliament. Another unexpected result for a Tory leader?
Five more years of no 'strong and stable' leadership - who can/will the Tories form a government with?
This election proves however that Labour is not the lost cause that many suggested, UKIP is clearly a spent force and should just go, Scottish voters have moved away from their protest voting at the last election meaning the SNP has lost over 20 seats.
So now about a year of the two we have to negotiate Brexit will be wasted as our domestic government has to be sorted out and the direction the new government wishes to take us is sorted out.

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