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Zulu 22

Apologise for doing your job ?

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Madness, how can a PCC get away with this rubbish, officers in Northants need to completely stop searching people for a short time to stop all this nonsense.

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Who is going to be the arbiter  of this and how much time and effort will go into each investigation and I wonder if the PCC knows that we stop people on 'suspicion' i.e. a very low trigger meaning that it will be very easy for each stop to be justified.  

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And then, officers will get to be accompanied on their patrols so that people that have been stop-searched can see us work.

 

And listen to our radios.  And go to houses of people they know, while we deal with them.

 

 

As has been pointed out, there are already procedures in place to deal with complaints.  You can't make an officer apologise.  You can ask them to, but at the end of the day, they don't have to.  What's the PCC going to do with an officer who refuses to apologise because he believes he's done nothing wrong?

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The PCC wants to reduce stop and search, but surely that is an operational matter which is territory that he should stay well clear of.

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I stopped and searched many people during my service and have to say that I usually served in places and at a time where people expected to be stopped and searched by the police. This applied mainly (but not exclusively) to young males because they were the main perpetrators of  most types of crime happening in the areas I worked and were the type of individual normally found in places and situations where some factor might lead to me suspecting they required searching. ly 

Most of the time, these searches proved negative and in those circumstances I would offer a polite apology along the lines of, ``Sorry you've been troubled. I'll let you get on your way now.''

If they asked why I had searched them (rarely done) I told them and they would usually go on their way.  If they became abusive they would receive a warning about what would happen if they persisted and if they continued they would be arrested. In over 30 years service I only received one complaint about searching a suspect and that was not proceeded with because he was a well convicted drug user and had a strong odour of cannabis on his clothing and my reasons for searching him were justified. 

An apology of the type I have described in simple good manners and I see no reason why officers should not offer one along these lines. However, I have the feeling that an apology of that type/level is being held as insufficient nowadays and what is now being sought is an groveling apology of an obsequious nature and I'm afraid I would rather offer no apology at all than sink to that level just for doing my job.   

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OC, Similar except, it was not really an apology but an explanation showing respect and good manners.

Edited by Zulu 22

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If this proposal by the Northants PCC is introduced, the reasons for having grounds to stop and search must be broadened to include stopping and searching anyone who is known to be a scrote, a friend of a scrote or suspected by their demeanour or conduct of being a scrote. It's a bit like the former use of the Vagrancy Act 1824(S 4) or the Met Police 1829 (S 66) - sound preventative policing aligned to the primary objects of policing - the preventation of crime and disorder!. Or maybe this PCC doesn't see this as the primary object of policing any more?

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Has this person ever been a police officer; or better yet, are hair-brained ideas a prerequisite for being appointed to positions like this?

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Croby, very few of the PCC's have ever been a police Officer and those that have, all seem to have gone over to the 'dark side'. They were given a remit as to their responsibilities and one that was not included in this remit was to do with operational matters which should be left to the Chief Constables. This has been breached time and time again!

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Most disturbing is they don't seem to 'get it' that they appear to be undermining CC's and police officers when they make statements like this.

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I stopped and searched a group of youths/young people recently.  All of them were innocent - just wrong place at the wrong time.

 

I said "Thank you for understanding" as I left them............

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Who is going to be the arbiter  of this and how much time and effort will go into each investigation and I wonder if the PCC knows that we stop people on 'suspicion' i.e. a very low trigger meaning that it will be very easy for each stop to be justified.  

 As you say, the trigger is of a low threshold. So their would unlikely be a problem justifying the actions. I do not see a problem.

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Excuse me if I'm wrong but as Steve White suggested either a stop is lawful or it isn't. If it is, there's nothing to apologise for, and if it is, there's already a procedure to deal with it.

 

I imagine that it will also be quite unhelpful to have a patrol car unable to go to Grade 1 incidents for half a shift due to carrying a civilian passenger.

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