Sign in to follow this  
Maverick22

D & C Crime Rise

Recommended Posts

http://www.thisiscornwall.co.uk/Crime-rises-Devon-Cornwall-police-cuts-hit/story-15864528-detail/story.html ACPO will never admit that the decrease in numbers has any effect on the rise in crime. They will always find a reason to blame other factors.

This highlights the old adage, 'lies, damned lies and statistics' ...

It raises an interesting point - does this mean the fall in crime usually attributed by the powers that be to having more staff on the ground is equally flawed? Because this is the natural other half of the argument.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We were told towards the end of March not to record any burglaries and violent crimes, but to pass them on to our detections team for a little judicious "revisiting" as we were on the cusp on achieving another year on year reduction. As well as being ethically dubious, I felt it was extremely short-sighted as it would give those in authority the perfect excuse to claim that the cuts are having no impact on crime levels.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's that sort of behavior which makes the statistics meaningless. It's statistically as bad as stripping to your undies to register a weight loss at a weight watcher's meeting.

It shows the measurements are being used for the wrong reasons. Statistics should be used to measure true effectiveness, not someone's worth.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's that sort of behavior which makes the statistics meaningless. It's statistically as bad as stripping to your undies to register a weight loss at a weight watcher's meeting.

It shows the measurements are being used for the wrong reasons. Statistics should be used to measure true effectiveness, not someone's worth.

It also shows the the SMT of forces throughout the country are being , at best dishonest, and at worst criminal. I believe that falsehood and prevarication is still a disciplinary offence.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is nothing new under the Sun and, as one of the (I suspect) oldest regular posters on this Forum, I can confirm that the massaging and downright fabrication of crime statistics has being ongoing for a great many years.

It was certainly prevalent when i joined in the mid-1960s but I did not realise the full extent to which this fraudulent scheme was practiced until I entered the CID and discovered almost every CID officer was involved in this perfidy. Even those purporting to be practicing Christians were up to their necks in this corruption (and that is exactly what it was) and seemed to see no harm in what they were doing.

As a junior D.C.I took my Force on and declined to take part in this dishonesty, and that really set the cat among the pigeons. I was threatened with transfer back to uniform, among other things, but stuck to my guns and eventually won the day,and remaining in the CID. I was later told certain senior officers were very concerned I might resign and go to the Press with details of how they were `fiddling' the stats., and particularly the detection rates.

During the remainder of my service I constantly opposed the fabrication of statistics and always noted an increase in reported crime wherever I was posted and had many battles with SMT over the matter. I have no doubt these increases were because I always insisted that my staff record crime accurately.

The dishonest manipulation of crime stats. always involved cutting off your nose to spite your face and it has always amazed me that the FED have not taken up the cudgels over this malpractice which is so easily provable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

oldcopper - I went to a caravan site where eleven vans had been broken into. I submitted eleven C.I.D 1's(initial crime report). A few days later I was summons to the D.C.I's office, where I was told in no uncertain terms that it was just ONE OFFENCE, and to submit one form only. A few days after that I arrested a lad who admitted all the break ins, submitted ONE C.I.D 2 form,(detected crime report) was urgently summons to the DCI's office, and told to submit eleven C.I.D 2's. I crime but 11 detections. When I saw the District Supt and pointed out what had happened, I was told politely, ''You just put the forms in, let the C.I.D worry about the stats''.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have always said that we should be assessed on how many incidents we deal with, not how many crimes we record or detect. This would give the public a proper idea of what we have to deal with, day in, day out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ORIGINALLY POSTED BY MAV 22

oldcopper - I went to a caravan site where eleven vans had been broken into. I submitted eleven C.I.D 1's(initial crime report). A few days later I was summons to the D.C.I's office, where I was told in no uncertain terms that it was just ONE OFFENCE, and to submit one form only. A few days after that I arrested a lad who admitted all the break ins, submitted ONE C.I.D 2 form,(detected crime report) was urgently summons to the DCI's office, and told to submit eleven C.I.D 2's. I crime but 11 detections. When I saw the District Supt and pointed out what had happened, I was told politely, ''You just put the forms in, let the C.I.D worry about the stats''.

I experienced almost identical situations several times. More than once I declined to comply with the manipulation and told senior officers they were giving me (or one of my troops) an UNLAWFUL order. On the occasions that happened they let the matter rest.

One `friendly' senior officer told me I got away with it because SMT were aware of the incident I described in my previous post when I went to the wire with them over stats. while I was a D.C.

It has always been a mystery to me that i reached the dizzy heights of Inspector and, equally so, I have always been puzzled why so many Police Officers, often men and women who are otherwise scrupulously honest, indulge in such practices to their own detriment. However, it is only one of many instances where Police Officers shot themselves in the foot and act to their own detriment.

Do they put something in the food at training schools to dumb us down or does some form of brainwashing occur during the probationery period?

I have never understood why so many Police Officers have a desire to fabricate stats. to their own detriment, but it is just one of the many ways in which Cops constantly shot themselves in the foot

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The simple answer to that, Old Copper (which I suspect you know) is that people truly believe that if they please the bosses they will get the career progression they are hoping for, especially as this could be seen to be happening for many years. Even now the officers who cuff jobs and therefore record little crime get places on prestigious "squads" because it is known that they can get rid of jobs, so many people go along with it. On returning to the frontline a few years ago I was aghast to witness junior colleagues telling blatant lies so they didn't have to record crimes and stated that I would not be involved in such practices. Our Inspector then put me on an action plan for "recording too much crime", so I went to see him and asked him to show me exactly which crimes I had attended should not have been recorded as such. Of course he couldn't come up with any and pretty much had to back down, but few people are as old and bolshy and not bothered about "squads" as me!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You are correct mummypatrol and i have to say that it was ever so.

However, congratulations for being honest and having the courage to face up to your Inspector. Your action proves to me, yet again, that if you face up to SMT when you are being honest they will almost invariably back down.

When I hear of such things happening, I must say that it lessens the support I have for serving officers in their current situation relating to the attack on their pay and conditions as it appears to me that they are, to an extent, authors of their own misfortune.

There is no point in complaining about a situation when you are unwilling to do anything about it yourself.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I also told the Insp that if he concluded that I was recording crime correctly, then logically he should then investigate all the officers who were recording significantly less crime. He was flabbergasted. It never happened, needless to say, but every so often I hear about colleagues getting picked up for over-recording; a few of them realise that if they were caught out falsifying figures then they would receive no support whatsoever from managers who would deny all knowledge of it. They spend so much time fretting about what's recorded and what isn't, I keep asking them why they don't have a designated crime recording manager who could make the decision about what is recorded as what. It would free up many hours of managers' time and make life a lot easier for those of us who are regularly beaten round the head metaphorically for what and how they record as crime.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This has gone on for years and will NEVER change. I dont think you can believe police stats are correct with regards to crime, I thiink now we should crime everything and let the figures go through the roof. When I first started I can remember attending a street where Eight cars had all been vandalised. Submitted One crime report, the old paper ones and wrote the details of the other Seven on the back of the report. That was the way it was done in those days. Also can remember CID having an advice book for people who wanted a referance number for a crime for there insurance.

Still hoping that the Fed get there act together and go for industrial rights, this is the ONLY way we will be able to fight back.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

MUMMYPATROL

I like your approach to this issue. if everyone did likewise we might see some change and a more honest way of recording crime.

Your Force appears to be particularly corrupt regarding crime stats.

RED 1889

My policy, even as an Inspector, was to crime everything and i managed to convince a few others to my way of thinking when I drew to their attention the fact that they were shooting themselves on the foot. As ever, when SMT saw there was more than one of us to contend with, they stopped trying to coerce us into massaging the figures.

Sadly there are many officers who, although possessing the courage to face violent persons on the street and the morality to be honest in most things, do not possess sufficient moral fibre when it comes to confronting SMT.

The whole issue of the fabrication of crime statistics by the Police makes a mockery of statements made by senior officers regarding their desire to ensure integrity and transparency in the Police Force and shows, more than anything, that all their talk of professional integrity is mere hypocrisy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There are 2 hidden replies in this thread that you do not currently have access to as a Guest User of our forum. To unlock the forum register for an account for FREE today by clicking HERE
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.